MANILA, Philippines — With her shock of dyed hair – three colors as of this writing – Dr. Maria Serena “Maris” I. Diokno seems more suited for an iconoclastic punk rock band than for something as stereotypically staid as a history professor.

But not only is Maris Diokno a history professor, she is also the newly-installed chair of the National Historical Commission of the Philippiones (NHCP) – a government office better known for harping on singers who incorrectly sing the National Anthem.

Diokno is well aware of these unfavorable impression that history often holds in the minds of the general public, and just the iconoclastic punk rocker her hair makes her out to be, she says she is here to break that stereotype and change the way people think about history and the NHCP.

“'Ay ma’am boring 'yung history at mahina 'yung memory ko.' Haven’t you heard that? I’ve heard many students tell me that. When I teach history, that’s how I begin my class,” she says. “It's a challenge not only to me as an educator but as a historian. It's a challenge for the Commission because you're coming up against a perception that is genuinely shared by the average person.”

The NHCP is certainly meeting that challenge headon. Among the Commission's plans for the future is an increased focus on the production of local history and formulating a 10-year-development plan for the country's shrines that involves turning them into learning hubs.

Far from being boring, there's nothing quite like history, Diokno says, to exercise critical thinking and to sharpen the mind. She makes sure that her students at the University of the Philippines are aware of it. Rather than impose even more rote memorization, Diokno allows her students to make their own conclusions about the country's history – as long as they can back it up with evidence.

“In fact, I hate it when they just say this is their position because they know that ideologically, that is my position. I don't expect them to memorize everything. What I want to be able to do is to be able to think, make an argument, and marshall the evidence to support the argument.”

This desire to raise a country of critical thinkers doesn't stray very far from Diokno's own upbringing. As one of the 10 children of human rights champion and the quintessential nationalist Jose W. Diokno, Maris grew up no stranger
to passionate discussions about politics and history – most of which happened around the Diokno dinner table.

Even more than discussion and debate, she also shares that there was never a lack of support from her own family when she chose to make history her career.

Far from dismissing her chosen field as “lightweight”, she says that her father was the first to compare the rigors of historical study to the rigors of the courtroom.

“In a sense, both law and history are investigative in nature. You uncover evidence, and when you have it you don't necessarily believe it,” she says.

Even now, Diokno says that her father's name is a big factor in pushing her to succeed in her current role as the chair of the NHCP.

“What was important to my father was that it interested us and that each of us children wanted to do it, and do it to the best of our ability,” she says. “To me, the responsibility is to retain the good name. That is the responsibility of any future generation because we're lucky we inherited the name.”

In this 60 Minutes interview, Dr. Maris Diokno talks about making history more than just stories from the past and bringing it to life for everyday Filipinos, about her dreams and hopes for today's Filipinos, and her call for every young Filipino to take a stand.

“Ayoko ng 'whatever' and 'as in'. Take a position. You might make a wrong position, learn from it, pick yourself up. Improve. Move on. But don't shy away from making a decision when you need to. Because the moment you avoid that it's like saying, you're okay with the status quo. You're retaining the status quo, which we all know needs to be changed and improved,” she says. (Ronald S. Lim)

 
STUDENTS AND CAMPUSES BULLETIN (SCB): How is the National Historical Commission of the Philippines (NHCP) making itself relevant to the times and to young people? People only hear about NHCP when people complain about the flag, the national anthem...

MARIA SERENA DIOKNO (MSD): Usually when you want to verify the facts, saan ba ito ginawa o itinayo, you go to NHCP. But certainly, the Commission is much more than that. That is why in addition to the development plans for the shrines, I have other plans for the Commission.

First, I want to support the professional practice of history, which means research not only on national history but also local history, to bring the history of the place closer to the community.

The second has to do with public consciousness. Perhaps, through the Department of Tourism, we can do a historybased tourism plan. Maraming mayaman at may matagal nang makasaysayang lugar na dapat malaman din ng mga turista, hindi lamang ng mga dayuhan kundi lalong lalo na ng mga Pilipinong turista.

Naniniwala din ako na may ibang paraan kung paano maibabalik natin ang kasaysayan sa kaalaman at consciousness ng mga tao more than through the established activities the Commission does like wreath-laying, flag-raising.

Gusto ko buhayin at maging bahagi ng pambansang buhay ang trabaho ng Komisyon. Ewan ko kung magagawa ko yan pero libre naman ang mangarap no (laughs).

SCB: Being new at the helm of the National Historical Commission of the Philippines, what are the challenges that you’ve encountered so far?

MSD: Our biggest limitation is of course the budget. We have a very small capital outlay from government which we use to restore buildings and structures. We only have P10 million this year and that would go to a handful of churches. One church alone built in the 1780s takes easily half of the capital outlay. We also maintain our shrines but we also restore historic sites and structures. Next year, I have been advised that there will be zero capital outlay.

SCB: Why is this the case?

MSD: There are competing demands for government funds, most of them legitimate demands. We’re not very high on the totem pole, our budget is really, really small. I’m almost ashamed to say what it is (laughs).

SCB: But what does NHCP really do aside from what people know that you decide on how the National Anthem should be sung or how the national flag displayed?

MSD: The larger mandate of the job is to promote Philippine history, not only in an academic sense which I do in my own job as a professor of history at UP, but also to enable it to enter the public consciousness.

It is also our job to give technical assistance. We send our architects and our engineers to look at a site, to advise them on how it can be restored, etc. There are many requests from local government units and civic groups about installation of historical markers, the declaration of historic sites or most recently, the declaration of the old town of Dapitan as an entire heritage zone.

Each of these requests we have to analyze in terms of the historical substance. Are they historically significant to begin with and what kind of recognition do they merit? And then if there are cost requirements we have to look into that as well.

Why the young need to study history

SCB: For curriculum development, how should history be taught, especially in basic education?

MSD: I will answer you as a historian and as a professor of history. Much has been said about the textbooks but frankly speaking the textbooks only proceed from the curriculum.

SCB: Do you think the curriculum is weak?

MSD: At the very minimum, there are factual inaccuracies, and biases that we identified. I spearheaded a project with the History department of UP where we examined public school textbooks from Grades 1 to 6, and from first year to third year high school. When I talk about inaccuracies, titingan mo rin yung illustrations, captions, pictures. Mabusisi pero madaling gawin.

Sa akin ang mas mahalagang kuwestiyon ay ito: Ano ba talaga yung gusto natin malaman ng mga bata? Kasi kung titingnan yung structure ng Basic Education, Grades 1, 2 and 3, panay Sibika at paulit ulit lang ng Grade 1. So pag Grade 3 uulitin mo, pag Grade 2 uulitin mo nangyari sa Grade 1.

Pangalawa, yung Sibika na itinuturo, Sa mga textbooks ng DepEd, nag-iimbento sila ng storya kay Ginoong Reyes, kay Mang ganito o Aling ganyan. Samantalang ang yaman yaman natin sa kasaysayan. Si Emilio Jacinto, 18 taon pa lang sumali na sa Katipunan, kung sumulat eh napakalalim. Where do you find 18, 19-year-olds thinking about our country and writing with such profound belief and conviction? Si Gregoria de Jesus, 21 anyos nung itinatag niya ‘yung women’s chapter ng Katipunan. So maraming mga role model na bata, hindi kailangang matanda.

SCD: So what is the best way to teach History then to our children?

MSD: Ang gusto ko sana from Grades 1 to 3, local history. Paano mo ipakikilala sa isang first-grader ang konsepto ng national history? Mas alam nila ‘yung komunidad, saan ako nakatira, saan ‘yung simbahan, saan ‘yung pagamutan, kasi may kinalaman sa araw araw na buhay nila ang mga sites na ito. Importante na may sense na siya kung ano man ‘yung identity with regards to the community. And then you can put the basic skills, how to make a map from the school to the church, from house to the school.

By Grade 4, that’s when we can introduce the concept of nation because at a certain point when you’re understanding your local identities, kailangan mag level off yan nationwide.

At a certain point you have to bring in the national history, who we are as a Filipino. Yes I am a Visayan but I am also a Filipino.

SCB: The basic education curriculum focuses on Math and Science because many think History is just memorization…

MSD: That is wrong! If that is the case, it’s because it’s not taught well. I’m concerned about what historical competencies we are teaching our children. And the way I see it, the most important and sometimes the singular competence being taught is factual recollection. That’s crazy! But what you don’t forget if you are properly taught is critical thinking. That’s what history is about.

SCB: But Filipino students are mostly just made to memorize facts and figures…

MSD: Ang dinidiin halos ng mga textbooks at ng curriculum, puno’t dulo nun mamemorize, factual recollection. I teach graduate school at mga estudyante ko mga Social Studies teachers. Inamin nila “Ma’am pag inaral namin yan sa Grade 4, by Grade 5 nalimutan na ‘yan ng mga bata. Kasi nga memorize lang, pass the test, tapos! Hindi nainternalize kasi walang tumutuhog sa mga facts.

SCB: Why is learning History important then to a nation?

MSD: It is important to citizenship because when a politician or a public figure makes a statement, the citizens will be able to judge whether that statement or claim being made is credible or not. What do you look at? “Ay kasi guwapo siya, o kasi movie star o broadcast journalist.” No, you look at the evidence for the claim? What is her track record? Ano na ‘yung nagawa niya noon? Those are the skills that history teaches you.

History is basically a narrative, the inherent structure of history is a narrative, and children are natural storytellers. In other words, what we fail to do is to tap into that natural ability at a young age. For example, basic competency in history is chronological thinking. Unfortunately, the way that’s interpreted in history is memorize the dates. That’s not chronological thinking, that’s memory. Why is chronological thinking important? It’s what we call the scaffolding of a narrative. When you understand the proper chronological order, then you can understand cause and effect because no effect can happen before the cause. So the basic questions in history, bakit, sino, kailan, ano nangyari, ano naging epekto, that’s normal in any story.

SCB: Did you, like most students, hated history as a young person?

MSD: When I was in high school what I remember about history was, sadly, memorizing. I had a very good memory so I always got almost perfect grades. I could memorize the whole page, I could recite whole paragraphs, kaya ko 'yan (laughs)!

SCB: Young people regard history as ancient and old…

MSD: History as a discipline is not fixed. The facts are old, but the manner, the epistemological and the methodological way of approaching the past, change.

Half a century ago, the kinds of history you would have would be mostly political and mostly stories. It's not as deeply analytical perhaps in certain cases. But now, history borrows from many disciplines, just as many disciplines
also borrow from history. Now you have histories of almost anything.

Histories of families, history of sexuality, social history, cultural history, demographic history, of movements of population, all of these are now legitimate concerns of history.

SCB: But when did you first fall in love with history?

MSD: I only really loved history in university, and perhaps you can also say graduate school where you look at the more theoretical aspects of the discipline, the more philosophical dimensions of it, and you understand it. There are many questions that we will never be able to answer because not every single human event is witnessed by a human being. That to me is what makes history interesting.

When my students ask me things, I am not afraid to say “I don't know,” because there are some things you really can't ever know. You can infer, you can surmise, but you must provide me your evidence, and you can provide two conflicting but certainly, possibly, legitimate points of view about a particular event.

Her father's daughter

SCB: Was that why you ended up in this field rather than follow in your father’s footsteps?

MSD: My father was a lawyer, and he used to tell me that he and I were in the same profession, except all my witnesses are dead. He could crossexamine his witnesses, while I have to examine those that have been left behind and infer the many gaps, find any other sources to corroborate or fill in the gaps.

SCB: How are law and history alike?

MSD: They are both investigative in nature. You uncover evidence, and when you have it, you don't necessarily believe it. The instinctive reaction of a historian is to question and not to embrace. Is it authentic? Is it acceptable and credible? Can I rely on this person? Did this person speak with authority? Those are the techniques that historians ask, and I think in law there must be something similar, because if you have a vested interest at stake, surely it will affect your testimony. We call sources testimonies, witnesses, and the best source in history is the eyewitness account, not hearsay, not secondary but primary, and who wrote the account contemporaneous with the event.

SCB: Did your father love history, too?

MSD: My father had an avid interest in history. His library had a lot of history books. When I needed them, he had them. I was privileged.

SCB: So nobody ever discouraged you from pursuing what some would think as a “lightweight” discipline as opposed to politics?

MSD: My father never interfered with our career choices. What was important to him was that it interested us and that each of us children wanted to do it, and do it to the best of our ability. He never even imposed that we get good grades. Of course, my father was a brilliant guy, summa cum laude, flat A and everything. He topped the Bar without taking a law degree (laughs)! I told him once that he's abnormal and that I'm normal, remember that (laughs)! I used to tease him about it.

SCB: Did you ever take part in protest actions alongside your father?

MSD: Madami! Since college, even before Martial Law, I would join rallies. I remember one time, my father was speaking at Plaza Miranda. He was a senator at that time and I never went with him, I would be with other groups of students. Minsan natakot ako kasi may lumapit sa akin. Ayun pala hinahanap ako ng Daddy, pinapahanap ako (laughs)!

When he was detained, we spent all the hours that we could visiting him. When he was released, he plunged immediately into human rights work and the struggle against the dictatorship. We were all involved and we used to join him in all kinds of things. At the time when he was released, kakaunti lang 'yung nagra-rally. Ilan lang kami tapos doble, triple 'yung bilang ng mga Metrocom. Pero sige, tuloy ang laban (laughs)! You build, you make small steps, until people muster their strength and their courage and it becomes contagious. Kakalat din 'yan. But siyempre there has to be a beginning. Dumami lang nung na-assassinate si Senator Ninoy Aquino.

SCB: Did you know at the time that you were participating in these protest actions that these events were going to be a big part of history? Or did you just focus on running away from the Metrocom?

MSD: We didn't run away from the Metrocom, we faced them! But I never thought if this was going to be important. Our concern was that we had a goal, which was resisting the dictatorship, and this was the way that we could articulate our objection. People like Rizal or Bonifacio or Mabini never wrote anything thinking they would be honored for it. They simply did it because they believed in it. They had no doubt in their minds that this was the right thing to do. And I think that's the best intention because the moment you think about how you will be looked at in the future, you will measure your actions.

SCB: Was it difficult growing up with the surname that you have? Were there expectations hoisted upon you because of your father?

MSD: No. The usual is “Ay, Diokno, mautak. Magaling 'yan.” Of course, because my father talaga was mautak. We didn't feel any pressure from him. My siblings and I, we all read a lot because of my father. We discussed politics and many things around our dining table.

SCB: But there is responsibility that comes with the name…

MSD: To me the responsibility is to retain the good name, my father and my mother did. That is the responsibility of any future generation because in a way we’re lucky we inherited the name, but you can destroy what you inherit.
SCB: A Diokno was recently in the news in connection with the Bureau of Corrections…

MSD: Ang daming tawag, pati sa mga bata, ano niyo ‘yan? It shows that my father built a good name, he was clean above all and dedicated to his work — strong convictions. You may not have agreed with every position he took but he adhered strongly to what he believed in. And he always put the interest of the country before his own, in fact, even before our family, his own. That is a name and reputation you cannot buy with money.

SCB: Was it hard for the family for your father to put the country before you?

MSD: I honor my mother, greatly, because mommy raised all of us, 10 children. And I don’t know how she did it. Mommy is just amazing, she supported my father in all his endeavors.

When he was arrested during Martial Law, she assembled us and said “You children have to take care of yourself because my first responsibility is to your father. Learn to take care of yourself.” We did. Our youngest was only eight
that time and the eldest was already married. We learned to take care of each other. But, none of us children have any regret. We’re proud of both our parents.

SCB: What’s the best lesson you learned from your father?

MSD: Many things. His beliefs. During Martial Law, he didn’t win many cases, matindi ang kalaban but he never gave up. I asked him once, “Why do you keep going?” and he said, “You have to believe in a cause that is greater and
beyond yourself. Because if you don’t, the first instance of loss, you’ll give up. That’s what to keep you going. You have to be driven by something bigger than you.”

I never forgot that because that explains him, in many ways. Whatever position he took — against the dictatorship, in favor of human rights, in favor of our sovereignty against the US bases — he was always guided by a cause
beyond himself.

He used to remind us that he was not struggling for himself, that is why the title of the book published in his name was “A Nation for Our Children”. He said this was not for him, because probably he would not have lived to see the
fruit of his labor but he said this is for you and your children, and your children’s children and their children and so on. So he had a vision beyond himself. He did not expect that if he did something now, and he succeeded and he
himself would have to enjoy or benefit from it. He was quite prepared to leave the enjoyment to succeeding generations. To me that’s a wonderful lesson to learn that has guided most of us in the work that we do.

When we would ask him, sometimes his positions may not be popular.

He would say, “That’s true but doing right is not always the popular thing. Sometimes you have to say no. It’s easier just to say yes and accept the bribe and entering a deal but that’s not the right thing to do.” He was very clear
about that. I like that. How many men and women you can find that way now? Hard di ba?

SCB: Your father was also very quotable. Do you have a favorite quote of him?

MSD: He really wrote beautifully. There’s this piece he wrote about how beautiful our country is but I can’t remember now because if I paraphrased him, nasisira, nawawala ‘yung context. Like what I’ve said, I’m a normal girl. He was
a brilliant mind (laughs)

SCB: Senator Pepe Diokno had so much faith in the country and its people. If he were alive today, do you think he would still keep that faith?

MSD: Yes. One thing about my father is that he never, never lost faith in our people. He might have questions, reservations, criticisms of certain leaders but to the people, his faith was unwavering.

SCB: Do you share that same faith?

MSD: Yes.

Teaching history...and loving it

SCB: We heard you are a popular teacher in UP…

MSD: I think to be a good teacher, you really have to like what you're doing. It doesn't pay you well, it doesn't give you much material gratification, but you enjoy it.

I'm conscious about making an effort to link history to the lives of my students. When I talk about the Reform Movement, I ask them how old they are and tell them na ka-edad lang nila ang mga nasa Reform Movement. Kayo ba
nakakaisp ng ganyan? Eto sinulat nila, makakisip ba kayo ng ganyan, aber, aber? Napakaganda ng sinulat nila Rizal, ang lalim. Then the students begin to think.

Second, you have to be open-minded. I always tell my students that they shouldn't expect me to agree with their conclusion, because I'm not as interested in that as to how they can argue it out. I may have reservations about your
point of view, which I am entitled to, but so are you. You can formulate your own interpretation. What is important is on what grounds and on what your evidence is. How do you argue it, how do you think it out. Is it logical, do you
put pieces together?

I don't expect them to memorize everything. What I want to be able to get from them — and I'm not sure if I'm successful — is for them to be able to think, make an argument, and marshall the evidence to support the argument.

SCB: Do you have a favorite moment as a teacher?

MSD: When a student comes up with an insight I never thought of. I love it, I love it! I pounce on it and I encourage the students to explain it. It means the student is actually thinking, that he thought about something I never have.

SCB: You were considered for the UP presidency.

MSD: Yes, I was nominated. When I was asked to run for the presidency, I did think about it, because it's more comfortable not to be president. You don't have to attend all these problems and concerns from students, faculty, and
staff of a university with seven campuses. I knew that the process would be rather political, and I have such a high regard for the academe that I did not want to engage in politicking. Some people said that I should have collected
signatures. Puwede kang tumayo dun sa dorm and have students sign. You can have faculty sign. Pero hindi naman 'yan numbers game, academe ito and the primordial qualifications should be your academic credentials.

SCB: You have a Facebook fan page with lots of followers.

MSD: I didn't even know that. Maybe those are the crazy students (laughs). I don't think the board looks at that. Too digital! They look at signatures. I thought that regardless of that, the board would evaluate those credentials and
then compare you with the others. Well, as I said, I thought (laughs).

Of history boys and ballroom dancing

SCB: How do you relax?

MSD: I exercise with ballroom dancing, that’s what I do regularly. I’m really into Argentine Tango now, that I’m learning.

SCB: Do you have your personal dance instructor?

MSD: Yes, I have one. We’ve been dancing for so many years now, mga six to seven years. We suffer each other’s company. He is very politicized as well. We discuss the country and politics. Poor guy, nahawa na (laughs). One
time we even discussed Darwin. Yes, because he likes to read now, nahawa na. We discuss things.

SCB: Are you familiar with the play “History Boys”?

MSD: No. Tell me about it.

SCB: It’s about these teachers, teaching these high school kids in England. It started out as a play and now it’s a film. At a certain point, the female teacher gets so frustrated and she blurts out — “History is a commentary on the
various and continuing incapabilities of men. What is history? History is women following behind with a bucket.” How would you react to that?

MSD: In a way, because when you look at history and the way it is written, the focus is generally on male leaders, the kings, the popes, the generals, women are hardly ever written about. This then creates the belief that, okay,
who cleans up after you when you make your mess or when you make mistakes?

I’m not going to generalize that all men are wrong and all women are perfect, of course that’s not so. Although, women are a little bit more perfect than men (laughs). But I suppose that’s the context. Mabuti nga ngayon we’re paying
more and more interest to roles of women, which is important.

SCB: You always advice the young to make the world infinitely better, so what do you think is the best way to start?

MSD: You have an obligation to develop yourself to the best of your ability because you were given that as a gift. And it won’t develop by itself, you have to will it, you have to muster your strength and courage to develop yourself to
the best of your ability.

But don’t just develop yourself for yourself, you have to care about others. This is my concern especially with regard to our young generation. That perhaps because of pressure to earn a good living, land a good job, support the
family, it’s too inward looking.

Be prepared to take a position. Ayoko ng “whatever”, and “as in’’ — bawal ‘yan na sagot sa class ko. Ayaw sumagot in a categorical way? I said no, take a position. You don’t realize this has become part of the everyday usage of
young people but what it indicates is the inability to take a position. You might make a wrong position, then you learn from it, pick yourself up. Improve. Move on. But don’t shy away from making a decision when you need to
because the moment you avoid that, it’s like saying, you’re okay with the status quo.

If she were to go back in history...

SCB: You also said once that “Human history is replete with women and men with the initiative to change thing and make life better.” So which of these men and women that you talk about do you particularly look up to?

MSD: Gregoria de Jesus, because people look at her as the wife of Andres (Bonifacio) but she was a person in her own right. She didn’t embrace the Katipunan only because she was married to the founder. Those were convictions that she, herself, believed in. When her husband was arrested, she followed him, she didn’t leave his side. I admire her.

I love Apolinario Mabini. He is one of my all-time heroes because he wrote with such wit. I read him in the original Spanish, when he would describe the Americanistas, the other Filipinos in the Aguinaldo Cabinet who favored the
annexation or autonomy under American rule. Mabini opposed any kind of surrender to the Americans, he really wanted independence. He wrote beautifully, his mind was clear, he argued very well.

I like the way Emilio Jacinto wrote. At his age I couldn’t write like him. That’s what I say, when you admire someone, these persons did things at their age, I ask myself, “Could I write that profoundly?”

Of course, Rizal, every time you read him, you gain a news insight depending on the time of our history or the period of your own life that you are reading.

SCB: Is there a part of history that you would love to have witnessed?

MSD: I would have liked to witness all the discussions that were going on in the late 19th century among the Filipinos in Spain. It's true that at the time, the views of the Propaganda Movement were reform-oriented, but they were
debating a lot of things.

What it meant to be a Filipino, what did equality with the Spaniards mean? There was a recognition that we were not being treated the same manner by the Spanish colonial officials. I would have liked to witness this.

I've never thought of myself as a guerilla (laughs) so I wonder whether I could be a turn-of-the-century amazon fighting. The birthing part, that is always the fascinating phase about every movement because you learn the context and
you see the different reactions and perspectives. I don't believe that they all agree. I'm certain there were discussions and debates, as there should be if you want to establish a free, living, and vibrant community of Filipinos. You
cannot have everybody thinking the same way. I don't think that's what we struggled for.

The Japanese occupation, I've heard a lot of stories and rather detailed accounts from my mother, and that somehow made it real to me. How she said that as a family, they ran to the old house of Mabini, which used to be in
Malacañang and is now in PUP, in the shrine. Those make it alive because it's my mother's personal account, and I'm lucky that I've had the privilege of hearing that first-hand.

But having said that, I'm glad I was around during the dictatorship. My father's detention, of course, had a tremendous personal impact on my family but I am glad I was around not because it was a happy period, but because it was
certainly an important phase in our national life.